Thanks for all your comments I have been through my photos looking for the other 2 species and think I may have found Bombus cryptarum I've put it on Observations
What do you think?
No identification made yet.
No interactions present.
One of the B. lucorum complex - as I understand it, B. cryptarum is distinguished by a black streak running into the yellow throacic band from just in front of the wing base. There's a tiny black line on the right-hand photo, but I think the mark is thicker than this. So, personally I don't think it's cryptarum, but others may disagree...
It looks OK for cryptarum, but I would leave it as a possible. The collar looks too wide and long for lucorum s.s., and too narrow and short for magnus. But the black 'S' is not as obvious as it should be. This group is best treated with caution as regards specific ID.
Do you know of any good descriptions/id guides to the lucorum group now they've been split? Neither 'Bees of Surrey' not the 1st ed of Edwards & Jenner (don't know about the 2nd ed) split them beyond lucorum.
As I understand it (i.e. going by the BWARS website), for cryptarum there's a bar running into the yellow band as I mentioned above, but I've no idea how variable this is nor how to separate out magnus.
Everything is either trivial or highly technical. See Bertsch et al. 2004 Beitr. Ent. 54: 365-86 for original work and plates of UK cryptarum. In Benton's New Nat. book there is a cryptarum on p316 fig A, and magnus on p317 fig G. You cannot do males, and workers are usually unsafe. There is a lot of genetic/chemical research going on to clarify the morphological correlates. If in doubt, call them lucorum s.l. No one will mind.
Ta for the info - shall track down the refs,
Thanks for your comments, where is the black S
See http://www.flickr.com/photos/insectman/130718220/, but there is variation. Usually the 'S' is obvious once you are aware of what to look for.
Thanks for that link Urophora, very useful.
Entomologist and biological recorder
Thanks for the comments certainly not obvious from this photo
Lat/Lng: 52.1, -3.4
OS grid ref: SO0451